Post by Helmut83 on Mar 26, 2015 3:24:50 GMT
Hi, forum mates. Today I'm here for a multi-purpose narration which may serve as: 1) a cathartic exercise to vent my rage; 2) a warning to prevent you readers about something you shouldn't do; 3) a general interest narration for you civilized world dwellers to be more aware of how life can be in 3rd world countries; and 4) telling you about something which happened to a fellow forum mate and me. If you’ve got some time, sit back and enjoy. And trust me, by the end of this you will feel better about something as simple as being able to receive an international card or package by mail.
You have probably heard me complaining about how things are in my country regarding politics, about how the state permanently messes into your own life and that, and you probably thought "it's just another grumpy guy, I hear thousands of these every day". Today I will show you that, besides being a grumpy guy, I probably have more reasons to complain about those things that most guys you hear say that.
Well, the forum mate involved in this story is no other than the famous and acclaimed BSJ, one of the two heads of the monster, the one who plays percussion instruments. Last Christmas unomusette asked for our addresses to send us Christmas greetings cards, and I gave mine to her by private message, in a mini group in which BSJ was included too. I received that Christmas card without any problem.
Now, last week, on Thursday, I received by mail a note from Correo Argentino (the Argentine statal mail, which has a legal monopoly over international mail) saying that something had arrived for me from the US and that I had to look for it at a customs deposit which is downtown, approximately 1 hour away from home. Having in mind it only said “Helmut” as the addressee and that I knew BSJ had my address from that previous opportunity, I asked her and she told me she had sent me a letter with an ELO button pin made by United Artists to promote ELO’s first album “ELO (No Answer)”.
Well, we Argies are very well aware that we are not able to import anything (yes, you read well… no e-bay, no Amazon, no buying anything from other countries) nor receive any gifts by mail (yes, you also read well).
What I didn’t know was: 1) that BSJ was going to send me something, otherwise I would have warned her; and 2) that simple cards or letters were held by customs. So far it had been only packages which contained goods (of any kind), but this time they also held this letter (except in case they touched and realized it had something hard inside –the pin- and held it because of this, which would be ridiculous anyway).
I mean, in theory, every good can be taken away from customs; in practice, it’s next to impossible.
You have to go to the tax agency first and make a huge queue to get a password. Once you have that password you have to get into an incredibly messy internet website and find two forms which are very difficult to find, and then fill them with tons of personal information about yourself, your economic situation, the product you are receiving and what are you planning to use it for. If you don’t know because it’s a gift? Uh, there’s no solution planned for that. Once you filled and printed those endless forms comes the first time you’ve got to pay. For most cases it’s a fee of US$ 25 (which is a ton of money here). Then you have to go to the customs deposit with those forms and the receipt of payment all printed.
The employees of that place are people who make part of a mob which supports the government and which in many cases is used as their violent arm. They receive you and treat you wrong all the way. Then they send you to pay again, one fee for something called “presentation before customs” which no one knows exactly what it is and another fee for each day the package has been in the customs deposit. Once you also paid that they give you a paper with a mixture of letters and numbers which represents your turn. Then you have to go to a huge room in which the turns appear on a screen so you know you are being called. Being the turn numbers so complicated and circulating so fast through the screen, you have to be paying a lot of attention to that screen all the time or you can lose your turn and never be able to receive your product. There are some chairs there, but of course, never enough, and lots of people are forced to wait standing. The time you wait there averages 3 to 4 hours and can be longer sometimes.
If after such a long wait you were able to spot your number on the screen, you go to a counter where the products are. Employees search for them and ask you for all the papers, forms, receipts and the note you first received in your email. Once they find it (if they do, because many people told they never found their products), a rude employee opens the package with an inquisitive attitude as if you were a suspect or something, and sees which product you are receiving. Next thing, he is making you all sort of questions about what do you want it for, what are you planning to use it in or even who sent that to you. If your answers satisfy him/her, he’ll give you your package. Otherwise, he won’t give it to you and you are asked to go away from there (policemen are always near just in case) without further explanation, and all the money you paid is not returned to you –my sister had to go through this once she bought a couple of Chinese t-shirts-. Goods are supposed to go back to whoever sent them to you, but in practice tons of them are just plainly stolen by the employees, with the protection of the government, who handed them customs to make that.
Of course, even if you are willing to make all of the paperwork and to pay everything they ask you to pay for, you have like 20% of being successful, because in every step along the way there’s a good possibility that you will find yourself with a problem that has no solution and you are stuck there forever, with no return of any money you have paid before. There’s even entire internet forums dedicated to people who want to talk and ask for advice about this whole torture and how to take an international package out of customs. Very few lucky people are able to do it.
Well, I didn’t have to go through all of the torture I described before. Luckily by now I have heard so many stories that I was aware about some things. A few people on those forums said that, in the case of gifts, they were able to get them with just the advice note you first receive. I was decided to not pay a single cent nor fill in any form, but when I saw this I decided I was going to try my luck, even though I knew the probability of success was tiny. I went downtown and luckily I was rejected in the first desk you have to go through, and not having had to wait for very long. The excuse (because they are no reasons, they are just excuses they are supposed to find)? The addressee only said “Helmut”, not my full name (including middle names) and surname as it was supposed to be, something which was never a requirement here when mail worked normally (before this government came) and as I understand is not required anywhere when you send mail or a package to other person’s door -in fact, Uno’s letter arrived saying only “Helmut” in the addressee-. I tried to make the employee reason, showing her that the address that the note of advice had was the same address I had in my document of identification so if the envelope had arrived to where it was supposed to arrive I would have received it because I live there… too much logic for a bureaucrat whose only intention is to screw you.
So I took the train back home and told BSJ about all this (of course thanked her a lot for the fact that she sent me the letter, because it’s always nice knowing someone had you in mind for a surprise and to a certain extent the note of advice worked for that purpose), trying to explain the situation as well as I could. She couldn’t believe it and was really indignant about this. I hope at least she gets her ELO pin back. Having in mind how rare is to find an ELO fan, I think few people would give the pin the value it has for us so I’d think the probability of it getting stolen by the customs employees is relatively low and she might get her back.
Unfortunately, this has become one of the many hideous things we Argentines have to live with every day. Just to give you an example from a couple of weeks ago, a friend of mine has an Austrian girlfriend who, not knowing about this, sent him a good lot of chocolates for him and his family, and he received the advice card but never went to look for them because he already knew it’s such a huge waste of money, time and boiling blood, and you’re not even sure you’ll be able to get them that, at the end, the best you can do is hope the person who sent it to you gets it back.
Well, now you know you shouldn’t be sending anything by mail to Argentina.
You have probably heard me complaining about how things are in my country regarding politics, about how the state permanently messes into your own life and that, and you probably thought "it's just another grumpy guy, I hear thousands of these every day". Today I will show you that, besides being a grumpy guy, I probably have more reasons to complain about those things that most guys you hear say that.
Well, the forum mate involved in this story is no other than the famous and acclaimed BSJ, one of the two heads of the monster, the one who plays percussion instruments. Last Christmas unomusette asked for our addresses to send us Christmas greetings cards, and I gave mine to her by private message, in a mini group in which BSJ was included too. I received that Christmas card without any problem.
Now, last week, on Thursday, I received by mail a note from Correo Argentino (the Argentine statal mail, which has a legal monopoly over international mail) saying that something had arrived for me from the US and that I had to look for it at a customs deposit which is downtown, approximately 1 hour away from home. Having in mind it only said “Helmut” as the addressee and that I knew BSJ had my address from that previous opportunity, I asked her and she told me she had sent me a letter with an ELO button pin made by United Artists to promote ELO’s first album “ELO (No Answer)”.
Well, we Argies are very well aware that we are not able to import anything (yes, you read well… no e-bay, no Amazon, no buying anything from other countries) nor receive any gifts by mail (yes, you also read well).
What I didn’t know was: 1) that BSJ was going to send me something, otherwise I would have warned her; and 2) that simple cards or letters were held by customs. So far it had been only packages which contained goods (of any kind), but this time they also held this letter (except in case they touched and realized it had something hard inside –the pin- and held it because of this, which would be ridiculous anyway).
I mean, in theory, every good can be taken away from customs; in practice, it’s next to impossible.
You have to go to the tax agency first and make a huge queue to get a password. Once you have that password you have to get into an incredibly messy internet website and find two forms which are very difficult to find, and then fill them with tons of personal information about yourself, your economic situation, the product you are receiving and what are you planning to use it for. If you don’t know because it’s a gift? Uh, there’s no solution planned for that. Once you filled and printed those endless forms comes the first time you’ve got to pay. For most cases it’s a fee of US$ 25 (which is a ton of money here). Then you have to go to the customs deposit with those forms and the receipt of payment all printed.
The employees of that place are people who make part of a mob which supports the government and which in many cases is used as their violent arm. They receive you and treat you wrong all the way. Then they send you to pay again, one fee for something called “presentation before customs” which no one knows exactly what it is and another fee for each day the package has been in the customs deposit. Once you also paid that they give you a paper with a mixture of letters and numbers which represents your turn. Then you have to go to a huge room in which the turns appear on a screen so you know you are being called. Being the turn numbers so complicated and circulating so fast through the screen, you have to be paying a lot of attention to that screen all the time or you can lose your turn and never be able to receive your product. There are some chairs there, but of course, never enough, and lots of people are forced to wait standing. The time you wait there averages 3 to 4 hours and can be longer sometimes.
If after such a long wait you were able to spot your number on the screen, you go to a counter where the products are. Employees search for them and ask you for all the papers, forms, receipts and the note you first received in your email. Once they find it (if they do, because many people told they never found their products), a rude employee opens the package with an inquisitive attitude as if you were a suspect or something, and sees which product you are receiving. Next thing, he is making you all sort of questions about what do you want it for, what are you planning to use it in or even who sent that to you. If your answers satisfy him/her, he’ll give you your package. Otherwise, he won’t give it to you and you are asked to go away from there (policemen are always near just in case) without further explanation, and all the money you paid is not returned to you –my sister had to go through this once she bought a couple of Chinese t-shirts-. Goods are supposed to go back to whoever sent them to you, but in practice tons of them are just plainly stolen by the employees, with the protection of the government, who handed them customs to make that.
Of course, even if you are willing to make all of the paperwork and to pay everything they ask you to pay for, you have like 20% of being successful, because in every step along the way there’s a good possibility that you will find yourself with a problem that has no solution and you are stuck there forever, with no return of any money you have paid before. There’s even entire internet forums dedicated to people who want to talk and ask for advice about this whole torture and how to take an international package out of customs. Very few lucky people are able to do it.
Well, I didn’t have to go through all of the torture I described before. Luckily by now I have heard so many stories that I was aware about some things. A few people on those forums said that, in the case of gifts, they were able to get them with just the advice note you first receive. I was decided to not pay a single cent nor fill in any form, but when I saw this I decided I was going to try my luck, even though I knew the probability of success was tiny. I went downtown and luckily I was rejected in the first desk you have to go through, and not having had to wait for very long. The excuse (because they are no reasons, they are just excuses they are supposed to find)? The addressee only said “Helmut”, not my full name (including middle names) and surname as it was supposed to be, something which was never a requirement here when mail worked normally (before this government came) and as I understand is not required anywhere when you send mail or a package to other person’s door -in fact, Uno’s letter arrived saying only “Helmut” in the addressee-. I tried to make the employee reason, showing her that the address that the note of advice had was the same address I had in my document of identification so if the envelope had arrived to where it was supposed to arrive I would have received it because I live there… too much logic for a bureaucrat whose only intention is to screw you.
So I took the train back home and told BSJ about all this (of course thanked her a lot for the fact that she sent me the letter, because it’s always nice knowing someone had you in mind for a surprise and to a certain extent the note of advice worked for that purpose), trying to explain the situation as well as I could. She couldn’t believe it and was really indignant about this. I hope at least she gets her ELO pin back. Having in mind how rare is to find an ELO fan, I think few people would give the pin the value it has for us so I’d think the probability of it getting stolen by the customs employees is relatively low and she might get her back.
Unfortunately, this has become one of the many hideous things we Argentines have to live with every day. Just to give you an example from a couple of weeks ago, a friend of mine has an Austrian girlfriend who, not knowing about this, sent him a good lot of chocolates for him and his family, and he received the advice card but never went to look for them because he already knew it’s such a huge waste of money, time and boiling blood, and you’re not even sure you’ll be able to get them that, at the end, the best you can do is hope the person who sent it to you gets it back.
Well, now you know you shouldn’t be sending anything by mail to Argentina.